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Why the Doomsday Farewell is Not the Greatest

Guest contributor Liam Catterson gives his thoughts.

Army of Ghosts & Doomsday

Ladies and gentlemen, I love Doctor Who. I love it so much that I treat it like it was a child of my own. Okay, it is not the best thing to me, I hold that accolade to my Formula One, but I am a massive Whovian and ever since Christopher Eccleston took the keys to the TARDIS, I have never fallen out of love with it and I know the show’s supreme moments and the weaker ones. So when I heard earlier this week that SFX Magazine had unveiled Rose’s departure from Doomsday as the spot for ‘Greatest Sci-Fi Moment”, my jaw literally dropped. Are you kidding me?!

Guys, I may have been a fan of Doctor Who for nearly ten years and my awareness for the show has reached so far, but to credit that scene as the ‘Greatest’, even in Doctor Who history, is just utter poppycock! I severely question the fact it even beats the “I am your father” line from Star Wars because I love my Star Wars too and even that had a greater impact in history than Rose saying goodbye to the Doctor did. Let me analyse this scenario that is causing a lot of talk.

Do I hate the scene?

No I don’t hate the scene. I thought it was a very emotive one to be honest and really hit the Doctor right in the hearts. It was anguished and brilliantly executed. A great scene and end to another chapter of the Doctor’s life. But if that deserves to be the ‘greatest moment in Sci-Fi history’, you may as well award John Cena the greatest wrestler to breathe or John Simm as the best Master ever. Both are not the best but they are considerably good, at least. And I know we’re all open to our own opinions but I’m judging the recent negativity against the scene’s merit for number one. The scene is good, I will say that, and I do not hate the ending, but it’s not a standout marker for the rest of the guys to look at and say “Oh yeah, we have to make our finale way better than that Doomsday ending”. Hell no.

Like I said, do not get me wrong, the ending was a good piece and a great end to the series. It showed the humanity of the Doctor with his love for Rose vanishing, it showed the separation of a better love story than Twilight, the music was controlling and it was brilliant at the time. Then two years later, Rose came back and for me, it removed the purity of this scene, that goodbye was hollow for any Doctor Who fan because the Doctor got to see her again and Rose had a happy ending anyways when she had the Doctor besides her, albeit, Meta-Crisis. So no, I do not despise the scene but for it to deserve number one is a direct spit on the face to all the other scenes I can deem greater.

What should be number one instead of the Doomsday Ending?

day-of-the-doctor-capaldiThere are a lot of scenes that excel compared to the Doomsday ending to be honest. First off, I am going to suggest, Saving Gallifrey. How many fans jumped from their seats when the Doctors managed to come up with a plan to save Gallifrey rather than fulfilling what we had thought was going to happen? Adding to this, we knew Billie Piper was leaving Doctor Who by the early stages of Series 2. Saving Gallifrey was something I did NOT see coming. What I also did not see coming and I think everyone else can agree with me when I say, the debut of Peter Capaldi as the Doctor in The Day of the Doctor. I will tell everyone right now, when I saw those sinister eyes for the first time, I jumped all around my ex-fiancee’s room, screaming because that moment was amazing.

Any more scenes? Yes, I have a feeling that I will keep you here all day if I cited them all but the handful that deserves number one spot consists of Eleven’s regeneration, which I burst down crying; Amy Pond’s departure, which I believed had a more fitting ending than Rose’s departure; the revelation of the War Doctor; The Rings of Akhaten speech; the regenerations of the classic Doctors; Love from Gallifrey; the Doctor ‘dying’ in The Impossible Astronaut, I was oblivious to wondering how they were going to work their way around that one and that was amazing. My heart was even racing at that moment. Hell they even overlooked Adric’s death to put Billie and David on top. That is not cool. Adric’s death was painful and had a huge impact. Even Ace screaming “WHO ARE YOU CALLING SMALL?!” to the Daleks was amazing.

I could go on and on but I am sure we all have our own versions on what should be top and I gave an extensive explanation to the Saving Gallifrey moment because I have a heavy feeling that will be on top of most lists. I can’t see how the moments I have mentioned have less of an impact than Rose’s departure. Even the Master saving the Doctor had more, I felt. I remember watching it and screaming for the Master, jumping for joy whereas I gave just a stare and a little ‘Aw’ to the departure scene. It was sad, yes, but was it Doctor Who’s finest hour? Not even close.

My final thoughts

Doomsday Farewell Declared Greatest Sci-Fi MomentI am not saying this scene is not an emotional and passionate moment of Doctor Who history and it was, don’t get me wrong, but we’re not looking for the “Saddest Moment in Sci-Fi history”. Even so, I am an emotional guy and I didn’t shed a tear at that scene. What I shed a tear too was Adric’s death, to Amy’s goodbye and I broke down a lot when Eleven said his goodbyes. This isn’t a Doctor Who list because if we’re looking for great moments in Who history, this scene would probably be tenth because it is NOT the greatest ever. Even Darth Vader killing the Emperor was greater.

The other thing is, if you’re going to keep a scene great, do not ruin its purity two years later in the storyline as well, which is what happened with Rose’s return in Series 4. I was okay with Ten coming back in The Day of the Doctor because this was before his regeneration, but Rose came back after she broke down being told she can’t see the Doctor again…

Even if it is a small number who voted from such a big fan-base, they seriously must not have seen The Day of the Doctor, that or they got incredibly bored of it. The farewell was a wonderful scene, the score is remarkable, the acting is extraordinary but it doesn’t equate to the ultimate scene of all time. It is a fantastic scene for Doctor Who but I can name a lot more scenes that are an improvement over it. Yes, a great scene consists of how well the music is played, how great the acting is, how touching it is for the characters, but it has to play for the fans too and I can tell more people got pumped when the Doctor was saving his home planet or when the Time Lords granted him a new cycle of regeneration energy. I had more of a punch to the heart when Eleven removed the bow tie. Damn you Moffat.

The farewell scene between Rose and Ten is a great scene and has the mixture on how to make a brilliant ending to a brilliant series, but I felt more scenes had impact. Adric’s death had silent credits, Love from Gallifrey had a sombre Doctor, ready for death and then the Time Lords grant him a new cycle, the last bit of The Name of the Doctor revealed the Doctor had an incarnation we’ve never seen before. If those are not as great as the farewell scene between Rose and Ten, I will collapse worst than the Doctor did in Let’s Kill Hitler. Judging from the negativity, people have a different approach to the greatest moment in sci-fi history and I don’t blame them.

So I hope you enjoyed my basic rant against how Rose and the Doctor’s farewell is not the greatest scene in sci-fi history. And I suppose, there is one last chance to say it… Doctor Who TV… (Vanishes)

Step back in time...

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230 comments
sushigal007
sushigal007

Not a huge fan of this scene and certainly wouldn't rate it as the greatest Doctor Who moment, let alone greatest sci-fi moment. I've got loads of favourite bits over the years, but top place for me is tied between Barbara forcing her way into the TARDIS for the very first time, and the First Doctor regenerating. They may not be heartbreakers, but they were amazing in their own way.

taptapwho
taptapwho

Saving Gallifrey was not that great. It was always going to happen eventually and took away a lot of the lore RTD brought to the table. I want a flawed Doctor. Characters should be flawed. The most honourable man secretly being the killer if his own kind was perfect.

sezbezthewhovian
sezbezthewhovian

everyone has their own opinion.  Not everyone is going to say Doomsday is the best but not everyone is going to say that putting Gallifrey in a painting instead of burning it is the best.  There are different opinions everywhere we look so, technically, no one has the right to bluntly say that Doomsday is not the best because to some people, like me, believe that it is.   Where ever you are and whatever topic you choose, there will be people who believe and agree and there are going to be people who disagree.  it is like saying that 4 is the best Doctor and 6 is the worst.  6 might be someone's favourite and 4 might be someone's least favourite. 


LeeBeing
LeeBeing

Well... The power of the Tennant fan girls wishing they were Rose at that moment have more power than a collapsing super-massive blackhole.

wholligan1013
wholligan1013

Saving Gallifrey though? Many whovians didn't like that because the way it retconned the previous 8 years. And it wasn't terribly memorable for me. Didn't really evoke emotions.





Polyphase
Polyphase

to credit that scene as the ‘Greatest’, even in Doctor Who history, is just utter poppycock! 

That says it all and in a Doctor Who style, Well said :)

doctorwhomultiverse
doctorwhomultiverse

Think it should have been when the time lords forced him to regenerate in the War Games as ithe and his companions were betrayed by his own people essentially!

SarahSutherland
SarahSutherland

I would also say Saving Gallifrey. Id say the best scene in Sci-Fi TV history because it WAS history. 50 years of it.

IronWhovian
IronWhovian

The Doctors saving Gallifrey should've got it.

It was an amazing moment!

AztecsDaleksAndCavemen
AztecsDaleksAndCavemen

If I were to offer a Doctor Who moment for 'Greatest sci-fi moment ever' I would offer The Doctor's moral dilemma in Genesis of the Daleks.

CallumSimmons
CallumSimmons

I don't agree its the best in Sci Fi or doctor who history. There are many notable Sci Fi scenes in history that probably top it. Just my opinion. If doctor who was to win I would've chosen either the Doctors Saving Galifrey, The Fall Of Arcadia, The Death of the Doctor (I genuinely thought he was going to stay dead and this doctor was far future and the whole of doctor who would lead up to that then again I was only 15 at the time), One Day I Shall Come back, Smith, Tennant and Hurt around the moment, The first time the Tardis interior is seen, Rings of Akhaten speech, Love from gallifrey.

Liana21
Liana21

It's a great scene, I'm a romantic, I cry buckets with it, and i ven have a song about farewells and beaches that reminds me of it. But it's not the greatest or the one I've cried the most, I prefer Donna's, Amy's farewell or Matt's last speech.

Ikare Abides
Ikare Abides

I don't blame anyone would have preferred to have another scene from the show take the top spot.  "De gustibus non est disputandum", in matters of entertainment.  

On the other hand, people shouldn't blame fans who want another show-runner to take over from Moffat and are disappointed that Moffat is staying for season 9.




RichardTyler
RichardTyler

I also love Doctor Who. I have since my mother got me hooked as a child. Although all of the pseudo love stories that are incorporated in the modern continuation that have become major story arcs don't qualify for best when you have fifty years of television, audio dramas, Novelizations, animated films, the 1996 movie, comics, stage, specials, spoof's, and webisodes to draw from. However, that being said our beloved show has won a prestigious poll and a coveted spot at the top of a distinguished list.

Seaborn W Deadman
Seaborn W Deadman

While I do love this scene and think it was brilliant, I have to agree, I was a bit surprised it got number one, but I was mostly just happy Doctor Who was in the lead XD I also agree however that there are definitely other scenes from Doctor Who more deserving of the position...I'm a big fan of the Thirteen Doctors saving Gallifrey scene personally ;) that made a pretty huge impact.

Arkleseizure
Arkleseizure

I can remember at the time thinking that I would be hugely moved by this scene if only I'd given a rat's arse about Ten and Rose. But, as far as I was concerned, they just got in the way of the plot, so I was glad it was over. Unfortunately, it wasn't over. It carried on, overshadowing Martha, and ending up with the meta-crisis Ten solution that made me desperately wish that this really was the last we'd seen of Rose. (Among my reasons for loving Day of the Doctor is the fact that Billie didn't really play her there, and I loved her role as the Moment).

I must here state what I believe to be the most moving scene in Doctor Who:

Even after all this time he cannot understand. I dare not change the course of history. Well, at least I taught him to take some precautions. He did remember to look at the scanner before he opened the doors. Now they're all gone. All gone. None of them could understand. Not even my little Susan, or Vicki. And as for Barbara and Chatterton. Chesterton. They were all too impatient to get back to their own time. And now, Steven. Perhaps I should go home, back to my own planet. But I can't. I can't.

It's Hartnell in part four of The Massacre. Seek out the audio. It's truly heartbreaking.

ClaireAbraham
ClaireAbraham

There's no right or wrong answer to this. It's completely subjective. I probably would not have named it the best moment in the history of science fiction, either. What basically happened is that... it won a poll.  In any poll results, there will always be people who disagree with the results, and that's fine. What we have learned is that this was a scene that resonated very deeply with a lot of people. Some folks didn't feel it as much. My own feeling is that it was one of many great scenes from the history of Doctor Who, but I do wish it had not been diluted by Journey's End.

davidcm1991
davidcm1991

I definitely agree with this. Personally I think the greatest moment in the history of Sci-Fi should be the first ever regeneration. It was such a brave move, such a great idea and is not only what has made the greatest show in the history of Sci-Fi so great, but what has also possibly gave it infinite potential. I can only imagine what it would have been like to be sat there in 1966, witnessing such an event. Yes, Doomsday is great. Yes, there have been many other great moments in the history of Doctor Who. Yes there have been many other great moments in the history of Sci-Fi, but that first ever regeneration was the biggest game changer of anything in the history of television. That for me deserves to be top.

TheOncomingStorm
TheOncomingStorm

Loving the arguments you've started here Liam. I'm such a sadist.

Stradiwhovius
Stradiwhovius

I know I should avoid this particular thread. I didn't even need to look to guess that there would be an awful lot of arguing because people are refusing to take a contrary opinion! 

All I will comment on is that I commend the bravery of the writer, though perhaps the article does come off a bit superior at points. Also, I agree; but that is probably at least in part down to me despising Ten and Rose!

PaulMorris1
PaulMorris1

Wow! TEN YEARS A FAN!

And, yet you dodn't mention ANY of the Classic moment of Doctor Who!

"A tear, Sarah Jane"!!!

9101112
9101112

I have to agree with the article, it wasn't the "Greatest Moment" although it was really really good, but who's to say that TDOTD was included in the tally for the poll.....I do agree that the ending to TDOTD was IMHO the greastest moment in sci-fi but I am just a humble whovian with lots of love for Doctor Who....

FlopHairedWuss
FlopHairedWuss

Personally I thought the Bad Wolf bay scene undermined the the much more powerful scene earlier when Rose got taken to the parallel world. That scene said everything that needed to be said, making the Bad Wolf Bay scene just a reason to give fans unnecessary (IMO) closure. It would have been much more heartbreaking to simply separate them without the chance to say goodbye rather the less powerful tear-filled goodbye we got. A better contender for best scene would have been The Doctor's goodbye to Susan from The Daleks Invasion of Earth.






Fawkes_S_115
Fawkes_S_115

Be honest, are you 11-th fan who pretends not to be this one, aren't you?

stargazer0118
stargazer0118

Metro recently wrote an article in support to this scene.  

Google: 

Doctor Who: Farewell to Rose Tyler tops greatest sci-fi scene poll. Quite right too.

Ollie Walton Harrod
Ollie Walton Harrod

Firstly, just to let you know, your first 1 and a half paragraphs seem a tiny bit arrogant; along with various other times throughout the article.

When I first read the name of the article, I was thinking "Oh why would you write something like that. I am so gonna disagree with this". But since its based on the fact that it was voted 'Greatest Sci-Fi Moment', I suppose I agree. I think the whole 'Doomsday' ending scenario is so sad, and its really well done. But in terms of a sci-fi moment, it's not really the best.



Secondly, you say "even" the "I am your father line", as if that wasn't a great moment.

And again when you talk about it being a "better love story" than 'Twilight'; That really doesn't take much.

I don't like it when you say " that goodbye was hollow for any Doctor Who fan because the Doctor got to see her again". Firstly, you don't know the opinion of every Doctor Who fan, and I for one disagree and so does else I know, who I've ever talked about it. Secondly I do disagree, because, in my opinion, Rose's return doesnt make her 'Doomsday' leaving "hollow". The 'Doomsday' leaving makes Rose's retun better. I don't like the Meta-Crisis Doctor though. I don't really like that she has a kind of happy ending with him, because he's not really The Doctor. Obviously, I don't want her to end up with the Doctor; but not a clone.

I completely and utterly disagree with you about 'The Day of the Doctor' and saving Gallifrey being worthy, at all. Firstly, if you're going into later events making earlier ones hollow, then surely, 'The Day of the Doctor' makes every reference and emotional talk about the Time War destroying Gllifrey in Series 1 - 7 seem a bit pointless. Not to mention the fact that none of how it was done was really explained. And, in terms of Peter Capaldi's cameo, surely if the 11th Doctor knew about the Peter Capaldi regeneration, he wouldn't have been worried about dying permanently in 'The Time of the Doctor'. Of course, a lot of The Day of the Doctor was meant to just make fans go "woo", with the references, but in reality (obviously it's not real), a lot of it, doesn't actually make sense, as it's not really explained.

The Eleventh's regeneration, was aright, in my opinion. - Only alright as, I liked the story. But the Doctor imagining Amy felt a bit like he was ignoring Clara. Also I hate "I'll always remember when the Doctor was me". That bit just felt so much like it was purely for the fandom; especially since it had Matt Smith look directly at the camera, and I just didn't really like it.

Amy Pond and Rory's departure - I liked it, as it was unexpected (before Rory was touched). Though I didn't like it as much as Rose's.

The revelation of the War Doctor - I didn't like. It was cliche. I probably would have liked it, had John Hurt's role not been revealed at least a week prior to the episode.

The Rings of Akhaten Speech - I have absolutely no caring for whatsoever. I'm not sure why that speech gets so much love, when The Doctor has said so many better speeches than that. I don't think that speech was particularly good at all.

The regenerations of the classic Doctor's - Well, if any regeneration should win, I think it should be the First Doctor's regeneration, as it was such a good way of allowing an actor to leave, without ending the programme. That would probably have made a good top Greatest Sci-Fi moment. - I'm not sure what it was up against.


Love from Gallifrey - Not necessarily amazing, but one of my favourite Moffat era moment, possibly.


The Doctor ‘dying’ in The Impossible Astronaut - It was unexpected. But I don't think it was significant enough at the time. That's possibly not the right word for it. I mean that, it was obviously the beginning of a story arc, and obviously The Doctor wasn't actually going to end up dying, and we didn't know enough about it, so I wouldn't put it as one of the Greatest Moments of Sci-Fi (or Doctor Who).

How didn't you shed a tear in that scene, but you did in Amy and The Eleventh Doctor's departures. I suppose, to an extent, it comes down to who you feel for more, because I'm less keen on the Moffat era in general, and I didn't shed a tear on Amy or the Eleventh Doctor's departures. But I do think Rose's departure is a more emotional one, by far. Amy still got to be with the one she loved, just, in another time. And The Doctor lives on. Rose, however, and the Doctor, were left without any way of returning to the other. And though they do again meet, it's not really the same, and she doesn't really get to be with him. The 'Doomsday' ending, is the saddest moment I've seen on any TV programme.

Darth Vader killing the Emperor - Also a great moment.

I don't think more people did get "pumped when the Doctor was saving his home planet or when the Time Lords granted him a new cycle of regeneration energy". The Time Lords granting the Doctor more regenerations was hardly a big surprise, and it was really the only way it could have been done well; without being contradictory. And I know people did get excited over seeing Peter Capaldi's close-up cameo, and probably the saving of Gallifrey, but I think more people did care about Rose's departure at the time.

I did like the removing of the bow though.

Just to give my opinion on greatest moments:

I'm not sure about greatest Doctor Who moment, as there are so many, and I don't think any one moment, beats all others. But if a Doctor Who moment had to be put into the Greatest Sci-Fi moments, I'd have to say the first regeneration, as it was so clever. Though I actually haven't yet seen the whole episode in which it comes from (as it's missing). For a Greatest Sci-Fi moment though, I'd probably choose something from the film, 'Alien' (but I won't give away any spoilers for that - just see it if you haven't).





Ollie Walton Harrod
Ollie Walton Harrod

Well everyone has the right to say it; it just doesn't necessarily mean that it's true.

What you're basically saying is everyone has the right to their own opinion, but isn't allowed to say it because other people will disagree.

Everyone can say whatever they want. As well as for news, this site is mainly for debating. There is of course no point in just saying something is the best and that's that. But you're never going to stop people debating their opinions.

Ollie Walton Harrod
Ollie Walton Harrod

Yes, apparently so. This is a site for Doctor Who fans to communicate about and share their passion for Doctor Who. Yet it's being used to violently hate on, and try and discredit other people's opinions.

Ollie Walton Harrod
Ollie Walton Harrod

@Liana21 I didn't care for Amy and Rory's farewell or the Eleventh Doctor's last few words. Amy still got to be with Rory, only in another time. Which isn't that bad compared to nearly all of the other modern Doctor Who companion departures (temporary and long lasting). And the Eleventh Doctor's last few words, I hated. Firstly, a minor point: Him seeing Amy kind of felt like he was ignoring Clara a bit. Secondly, and more importantly, it felt like it was just for the fandom. "I will always remember when the Doctor was me" *while looking at the camera*. Looking at the camera is just acknowleging the fandom watching, and I don't like that.



Ollie Walton Harrod
Ollie Walton Harrod

Yeah that's what I said. Well you put it in more detail, but yes, the first regeneration was definitely a great moment, well worthy of Greatest Sci-Fi moments.

Ollie Walton Harrod
Ollie Walton Harrod

Adric's death was mentioned twice. Ace was mentioned, and quoted once. In terms of RTD, The Master was mentioned once, but other than that it's all past 2 series.

Ollie Walton Harrod
Ollie Walton Harrod

@FlopHairedWuss I disagree there. I think without that saying goodbye, it would have seemed more: ah sad, okay let's move on, can't do anything about it...

I think it was necessary


Regenerated Catterson
Regenerated Catterson

@Fawkes_S_115 Erm what? I think it is pretty clear I think Eleven is the best Doctor, however, if Five's regeneration, Do I have the right or unlimited Rice Pudding got ahead of this scene or any scene really, I wouldn't be that confused...Maybe the rice pudding scene but it was an epic scene between Seven and Davros...

Ollie Walton Harrod
Ollie Walton Harrod

Just to say something I forgot to add at the end: I do agree with your overall point (that the Doomsday farewell isn't the Greatest Sci-Fi moment ever), but I do just happen to disagree with a lot of other things you said.

Ollie Walton Harrod
Ollie Walton Harrod

@Thesilence_1994 Ikare is saying that it's okay to disagree with the results. But don't then just blame that on people who were fans of Rose, RTD, and hate Moffat. I know, it's confusing at first.

TheOncomingStorm
TheOncomingStorm

@Ollie Walton Harrod Well I agree with literally everything you said in that (very long) comment, apart from the 1st Doctor's regeneration being the best. I don't have a favourite Doctor Who moment.

ClaireAbraham
ClaireAbraham

@Ollie Walton Harrod @Thesilence_1994 I'm with you on this. It's one thing to say "This is not my favorite scene.  There are many others I like more." It's another thing to say "The people who voted for this scene are WRONG and we should show how angry we are that this won rather than something else." Screeching outrage happens on this site any time anything regarding Ten and Rose wins any kind of poll, and I am tired of it, because that outrage tends to come with the strong implication that people are not entitled to that opinion and their views should be disrespected and rejected out of hand.  


I wouldn't have voted for the Doomsday goodbye, either, but really, folks!

Mary Sue's Vertue
Mary Sue's Vertue

@ClaireAbraham @Ollie Walton Harrod @Thesilence_1994  You've hit the nail on the head Claire. There seems to be a kind of hysteria amongst a certain section of the fandom concerning any kind of recognition for the RTD era, especially if it involves Rose, now I don't know if this is resonating from newer fans [ post 2010 ] who find it hard to accept that the Doctor really cared for someone prior to the Pond's [ similar to what Rose was like herself, when she met Sarah Jane ], or a lot of the fandom are just fickle, I don't know ? The recent polls in the DWM would suggest there is still a lot of love for that era, with story's like ''Army of Ghosts / Doomsday'', ''The Stolen Earth / Journey's End'' and ''The End of Time'' [ all three of which are regularly derided by fan's on this site ] all fairing well with above average Average Scores. Now everyone is entitled to their opinion and I personally love the Moffat era as much, if not more than the Davies era, but I do think there is a '' bandwagon'' effect amongst some fan's, especially when it comes to Rose and Ten bashing , which is one of the thing's about this fandom which is really sad to see, because even if you didn't like them, you cannot deny their contribution to making ''Doctor Who'' the truly fantastic programme that it is

SimonThorpe
SimonThorpe

@Mary Sue's Vertue If you actually read the replies here, you'll soon find that many of the people who don't like this scene, and don't like the 10/Rose dynamic in general, were fans long before RTD got anywhere near the show. It's not all about 10 v 11 or RTD v Moffat you know, there are 11 other very good actors to have played the role, more if you count non-canonicals like Cushing & Atkinson or stand-ins like Hurndall. Not to mention all the very talented producers and writers who have helped it reach 50 years and beyond. A lot of the criticisms are from people who grew up with the programme and didn't like the direction it took during Tennant's era - Hollyoaks in space is a description I've heard often and fits rather well. There are people who made the show great, people RTD, Tennant, Moffat, Capaldi et al (all of whom were fans first) would acknowledge, long before anything you've mentioned and maybe, just maybe, the comments are reflecting the opinion that some of these people deserve a little more recognition.

Try taking a wider look rather than just forcing everything to fit into your neat, preconceived little boxes.

Ollie Walton Harrod
Ollie Walton Harrod

I think I hit the nail. Claire just made sure it was firmly in. Though technically I only hit it because Ikare and Silence were struggling finding the hole.

Sorry. I just wanted to extend that analogy/metaphor.

ClaireAbraham
ClaireAbraham

@SimonThorpe @Mary Sue's Vertue I personally have spent much of the summer exploring the Peter Davison era, (really loving Snakedance at the moment) and I recently spent a lovely night with my local Doctor Who group viewing clips that discussed the entire Patrick Troughton era in detail. He was delightful - it's a shame so much of his work was lost. You know, not all Tenth Doctor fans - and in fact, I suggest that the majority of Tenth Doctor fans - are not willfully and aggressively ignorant of any other era in the Doctor Who canon. Indeed, I'd suggest that anybody who ever feels like hanging out here probably are NOT ignorant of all the other eras. Folks are completely entitled to dislike the Tennant era if they wish, but there's a consistent patina of aggressive derision directed towards anybody who likes him the most. 


It's unfair and unkind. Since he's wildly popular, and he managed to bring in some people who did not like the other eras of Who, folks behave as if his fanbase was made up solely of people who want to sleep with him, and have no other interest in the show, or in science fiction in general. 


That's not even close to accurate. Tennant was a great Doctor - so much so that I think perception of his actual physical attractiveness is a bit exaggerated. (In many angles he looks a little like a rat.)  The acclaim is earned. He was my gateway into the Who universe, and I've discovered all kinds of neat things from other eras as well because of him. 


I would not have chosen the Doomsday goodbye as the greatest scene in the history of science fiction; (somewhere in the back of my head, Hal is saying "I'm afraid, Dave. My mind is going, and I can feel it.")  But the people who did choose that did not do so as a personal affront towards you, towards Tom Baker, towards Steven Moffat, Verity Lambert, or even towards poor John Nathan Turner, god help him. They voted for the option that spoke to them most, and they are allowed to do that.

Ollie Walton Harrod
Ollie Walton Harrod

@SimonThorpe @Mary Sue's Vertue I'm so sorry. I'll try and be more open minded, like you are; presuming that everyone here is oblivious to classic Doctor Who.

I, and I would guess, the majority of people using this site, have seen classic Doctor Who episodes. And I highly doubt, even those who haven't seen any classic episode, don't know much about it/aren't appreciative of it.

This very post, was first started, and continued, to say 'Don't blame RTD/Tenth Doctor and Rose lovers/Moffat haters for this scene winning'. In other words, 'it's not all about RTD vs Moffat'.

Lastly, I grew up with modern Doctor Who. Many people did. Some RTD era, and some Moffat era; probably a large cause of preference, and reason for debate. Also, we're in the Moffat era now. So, naturally, it's what is discussed, and as the RTD era is the only other modern era (so far), it works for a great comparison. Modern Doctor Who is very different from classic Doctor Who, and as less people are knowledgable on classic, than modern, modern is what is discussed more frequently. My point here being, understand why people talk about modern Doctor Who more, and aren't oblivious to Doctor Who prior to 2005.

So, why don't you, instead of hassling the people having a conversation agreeing with your point, go and be condescending and presumptuous somewhere else. Or better yet, Don't!


Oh and, RTD Doctor Who is nothing like Hollyoaks.

Mary Sue's Vertue
Mary Sue's Vertue

@SimonThorpe @Mary Sue's Vertue I never claimed it was all about RTD /Tennant or Piper, I myself have been a fan of this show since the early 1970's [Pertwee was my Doctor ] so I am fully aware that there is a lot more to this show than the modern revival, and in a previous post, i freely admitted that the ''Doomsday'' farewell scene was far from being the ''Greatest scene'' in Doctor Who's history, let alone the rest of Sci- Fi / Fantasy and Horror, but obviously a lot of fan's, both Whovian and mainstream, do like it. You have no way of knowing, that everyone who dislikes that scene grew up with the classic era , as i previously stated, i am myself a long-term fan of the series [ who kept the flame burning during the ''wilderness years'' ] and unlike some old school die-hards, had no problem adapting to the new, more character-based direction the show took upon it's revival. It felt modern and new, but it was still ''Doctor Who'', the show i  fell in love with as a young child, so No, i am not some over-sensitive Tennant fan or Shipper who believes there is nothing more to this series than those two, and i fully acknowledge the contribution of every ''single'' person who has ever worked on this brilliant show, and yes, that includes Pip and Jane Baker