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Capaldi & Moffat on Axons, Cybermen and the Master

The-Claws-of-Axos-axonsPeter Capaldi has said he would love to see the return of the Axons during his time as the Doctor.

The classic era foe first featured in 1971’s The Claws of Axos with Jon Pertwee. Capaldi told EW: “Axons appeared as these godlike creatures, but underneath they were festering bags of flesh. I’d love to see a modern version of that.”

Capaldi also desires to see the original ’60s-era Cybermen back: “I’d also like to see—this is really one for geeks—the return of the Mondasian Cybermen. They came from the Planet Mondas and first appeared in [1966’s] ‘The Tenth Planet.’ They were absolutely terrifying, with cloth faces. That was really creepy.”

Steven Moffat isn’t as keen though: “I always thought the Axons had a natural resemblance to a BAFTA. We’re not bringing [classic Cybermen] back, because they look like boys with [sweaters] pulled over their heads. But Peter and I are not having a fight about which Cybermen are better.”

And as for the return of the Master, Moffat is saying very little: “There’s always that rumour. It didn’t come from us.”

Step back in time...

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314 comments
Noybusiness
Noybusiness

The Cybermen in Series 5-7 were Mondasian, even though they looked like Cybus Cybermen without the Cybus Industries logo. So they've already been brought back, just not with the dated design.

Polyphase
Polyphase

Capaldi 10/10, Moffat 3/10. Oh he's such a know it all :)

SeanBennion
SeanBennion

You can tell who has and who hasn't seen Claws Of Axos. Those who haven't comment on the Axons looking like some kind of BAFTA like award but those who have seen it know the real truth. Those who haven't seen it find it and watch it, you are in for both a treat and a bit of a surprise. Also bring back Corporal Bell, but promoted. 



thribs1
thribs1

The Axons?? Surely they can bring back a better villain like the Eminence or Sutekh.

Benvenfold
Benvenfold

Personally, I still want a return of the Raston Warrior Robot..

Moves Like Jagaroth
Moves Like Jagaroth

This is not an either/or situation - if we can go back to Victorian or Shakespearean England, we can surely go back to an earlier era of any of the enemies, with the exception perhaps of those with the power to move through time.


12th Doctor
12th Doctor

The axons wouldn't have to look like BAFTAs. I agree and disagree with Capaldi, yes the Axons should return, but no the Mondasian Cybermen shouldn't - I like these Cybermen

Warisfiller
Warisfiller

I wish we had a showrunner that made an effort of bringing back the human aspect to Cybermen. At this point they're indistinguishable from robots. We need to see some flesh. The Earthshock designs were great, you could make out their moving jaws and that was creepy. Imagine if they showed one with a portion of its armor/clothes removed, and you could see the deadlike flesh of its back, purple veins. I also think they should be mismatched slightly, not all uniform. I like the idea that not every body is upgraded the same way. Some could still have most of their human-body, some could have had their legs replaced, or their head, or everything but the brain.

 Bring the body horror back to the Cybermen. They're not robots. They're people augmented with cyber tech.

Captain Grumpy
Captain Grumpy

I haven't ever seen the Axon episodes before but because they are described as "godlike creatures" maybe they could feature in an episode in Ancient Greece as they used to worship gods, just my opinion.

Moves Like Jagaroth
Moves Like Jagaroth

There was an old comic strip from Doctor Who monthly called Junkyard Demon which was a very effective use of a Mondasian should you wish to look it up.

Mercy Reborn2
Mercy Reborn2

I don't mind  if they dont come back, the Axons do look like some kind of award but it would be nice to see The Master again. They could upgrade the original cybermen maybe

PeterGecko
PeterGecko

I would love to see the Axons return, I found their episodes to be very interesting.

LucasW
LucasW

I love the Axons! I'd really like a UNIT story where a load of old characters return but it turns out that actually they were all copied by the Axons during their last visit. Probably wouldn't work, but I'd love it!

And as for the Cybermen I really rather love those original Mondasian ones, they are absolutely terrifying! If the cloth faces could be updated without wrinkles, it'd be brilliant. You can see how close to human they are, and that's really disconcerting. And also kind of heartbreaking, which I'm sure anyone else who's heard Spare Parts can vouch for.

They wouldn't work now, but I do love them. I would like to see the original design updated, not redone.

Oodkind is foretold...
Oodkind is foretold...

On bringing back the original cybermen, I think that wouldn't be the best idea, but I think making a more converted human-based Cyberman story would be a good idea, as opposed to the more "robot invasion" storylines of Nightmare in Silver and Doomsday. In my opinion, they have become too robot since The Next Doctor, and they should get back to their roots.

As for the Axons, it probably would be a bit cheesy to bring back, as they are very dated. However, if they managed to update the Axons without making them too gimicky, I think it could be very interesting. And if they're bringing back old villains like that, I'd like to see some Jagaroth. Is that just me?

Oh, and what's with the anti-arguing comments? The way I see it, the article is meant to spark debate on which side they agree with, but people seem upset. Did something really nasty happen here way back?  By the way, have I ever mentioned my hate for the term "Fandom?"

ilyootha
ilyootha

I'm not a fan of Axons, to be honest. I am, however, a big fan of the original 1966 Cybermen, but I really don't see a new episode with them being done today. Capaldi is right saying that that one is really for geeks.

Lord of Time
Lord of Time

So the current Cybermen look like a mixture of Classic and New who ones. Maybe an origin story that starts out with the two factions warring but then combining?

I prefer Miss Bosswald
I prefer Miss Bosswald

I often expressed on this website how much I hate fan service for the sake of fan service and this is a great example. The Cybermen were created after the first heart transplant. They reflected the advance of technology at the time. And that's the thing about technology : it evolves. It would make literally no sense for the cybermen to go back to a previous model that is less efficient. Why on earth would they? (Don't tell me : "Unlike the Daleks, Cybermen have a concept of elegance) The Autons were criminally underused in Rose. I'm still trying to figure out why there were Macra in Gridlock. Same thing for the Cybermen in Closing Time. Bringing back old monsters for the sake of it or because you're too lazy to write your own monster is not a proof a great writing/showrunning. 

 Notsosmartguy Will Kill the Moon
Notsosmartguy Will Kill the Moon

Y'know for a fanbase that claims the show is "to Childish" (which is total crap) alot of you really need to grow the freck up.

WellSpokenMan
WellSpokenMan

Capaldi is totally right with both these ideas! Moffat is as usually not seeing the amazing potential and pandering to the focus groups who don't really know what they are doing clearly. Would anyone really be against the Axons and Tenth Planet style Cybermen returning?

jackrudrum
jackrudrum

They have am aspect of this with the earpieces and half metal face stuff

But they've set cybermen as being robot shells with a human brain and heart and parts of the nervous system

floppy_who
floppy_who

@Moves Like Jagaroth And spare parts made very good use of them (they looked good in my head anyhow!) And the idea of a Mondasian Cyberhorse was interesting...

12th Doctor
12th Doctor

He's not a great writer. He makes things too complicated.

King Joffery
King Joffery

@SephoraNeedSeries8 In Closing Time`s defense, it probably would have been worse if there was a new monster because the story had to reunite the doctor with Craig, introduce alfie and set up the finale. If you had to also make a new monster, explain what it it does AND make it seem like a massive threat the story would be even worse, so I can understand why hey brought back an old monster

Moves Like Jagaroth
Moves Like Jagaroth

@SephoraNeedSeries8 With the greatest of respect this doesn't take into account the time travel factor does it?  We've visited Daleks at an early stage of development - why not the Cybermen.  Of course they're not going to devolve - that WOULD be silly, I think.

ilyootha
ilyootha

Nevermind the design. DAT VOICE!

I prefer Miss Bosswald
I prefer Miss Bosswald

@Moves Like Jagaroth @SephoraNeedSeries8 Except we've already had a Genesis of the Cybusmen. It would please the ""hardcore fans", those who are interested in the history of the show but it would definitely confuse the casual viewers. And Doctor Who shouldn't be for geeks, it's a family show. It's an awful mess to clean up...

I prefer Miss Bosswald
I prefer Miss Bosswald

@Moves Like Jagaroth @SephoraNeedSeries8 My point still stands. In Rise of the Cybermen/Age of Steel we see the Cybermen were created with the "robot" design. Going back to a point where the Mondasian Cybermen had the old design would be even more confusing for NuWho fans. 

I prefer Miss Bosswald
I prefer Miss Bosswald

@Moves Like Jagaroth @SephoraNeedSeries8 How is that patronising? How on Earth are they supposed to know about the mondasian cybermen if they didn't watch the tenth planet? For NuWho audiences, the cybermen were created in 2006 in the parallel universe with the Cybus design. 

Moves Like Jagaroth
Moves Like Jagaroth

@SephoraNeedSeries8 @Moves Like Jagaroth Anyone who has been watching consistently since 2006 is well aware by now the enormous history of the programme and the villains it includes - they are either on board with this or no longer watch.  I've not seen the 10th Planet either!  Fans find stuff out.  I don't know what kind of audience you're talking about to be honest.

Moves Like Jagaroth
Moves Like Jagaroth

@SephoraNeedSeries8 @Moves Like Jagaroth Your point was that for NuWho audiences the Cybermen were created in 2006, yes?  If people have been watching from then, they'll know it was an old foe from before their new creation as the Doctor stipulates.  If they haven't they may not be aware of the new Cybus line anyway.  In any event I can't see why you'd assume a NuWho audience is so prone to confusion - I still don't really get your objection to a Mondasian appearance.  I can't see why it should confuse anyone in a story which would undoubtedly reveal the reason for its appearance.